Is Salvation a Sure Thing or Dependent Upon Us? Part 1
April 26, 2015 at 7:08 PM 13 comments
I want to take a look at several sections of Scripture to determine their meaning regarding salvation and eternal security. You’ll recall – if you’ve read any of my previous articles – that I believe it is incumbent upon every student of the Bible to allow Scripture to interpret itself. We do this by comparing Scripture to Scripture, since ultimately, every part of it was written by God Himself. I want to discuss Hebrews 10:14 and Romans 8 as well as numerous other sections of Scripture in this short series. Keep an open Bible handy as we go through this, will you?
While it is doubtful that each person will ever arrive to a full (or even a 100% correct) understanding of God’s Word in all areas in this life, the chances of being wrong about God’s intended meaning diminishes the more we allow Scripture to speak to itself.
Since the beginnings of the Church in Acts 2 (yes, I’m aware that there are those who believe the Church was not “born” on the Day of Pentecost as recorded in Acts 2, but I disagree), there have been numerous misunderstandings regarding what the Bible teaches, especially concerning the New Testament. Logically, since the New Testament of the Bible wasn’t finalized for several hundred years after the included books were written, it stands to reason then that besides determining the Canon of the New Testament, much discussion needed to be done to determine exactly what the Bible taught regarding things like eternal security, the triune nature of God, the deity of Christ, etc.
These (and many others) are very important aspects of what the Christian believes. It cannot be stated enough how vastly important it is to comprehend them to the best of our ability as we submit our minds to the Lord for discernment and wisdom.
There are specific things which will make or break our Christianity. For instance, the belief that Jesus was “a type of divine” Person, but not God cannot save you. If the Bible teaches that Jesus was/is very God as well as a perfect human being, then anything less than this is – unfortunately – heretical. Jesus is God or He is not. There is no such thing as being “a god” as some would have us believe.
Some believe that a person’s view of Eschatology (study of end times or last days) will also make or break a person with respect to whether or not they are authentically saved. I do not find any connection whatsoever between what a person believes about the end times and that person’s salvation. However, I WILL say that those who do not believe in a physical return of Jesus believe dangerous theology that likens Jesus to a liar (not to mention the two angels in Acts 1). In my view they are fully deceived because they have arrived to their conclusions by allegorizing Scripture when there was absolutely no logical reason to do so. Today, a good deal of angst is directed toward those who believe in a PreTrib Rapture, a 7-year Tribulation, ending with the physical return of Jesus Christ to this planet, and the setting up of His Millennial Reign from his “father” David’s throne in Jerusalem. I have arrived at these conclusions through years of careful study and understanding the difference between taking the biblical text literally, literalistically, and allegorically.
Could I be wrong? It’s possible I could be and I’m quite certain when I stand before Jesus at the Bema Judgment Seat (for believers), I will learn of exactly where I went wrong. I do not kid myself into thinking that I will have everything all wrapped up and my beliefs will be 100% in line with God’s intended meaning, when I stand before Him. It simply will not happen. I’m quite certain the Lord will “straighten” me out in His love and compassion.
For the remainder of this article, I want to talk about eternal security. It is in vogue today to believe that authentic Christians can lose their salvation if we aren’t faithful to God. Quite frankly, I believe this is error and I have studied both sides of the issue for some time. Could I be wrong? Yes, absolutely, I could be wrong, but I believe I’m trusting Him to set my course, to illumine my heart through faith in His ability to guide and direct my steps. He knows how desperately I want to know Him and His truth and I trust Him (continual, ongoing) to make that happen.
So what about whether or not a Christian can lose his/her salvation? Is it possible? The short answer for me is no, not from where I sit based on my understanding of God’s Holy Word. We could go back and forth discussing passage after passage of Scripture, literally hitting each other over the head with it (and many do), but unless we are willing to look at overriding principles, we will likely not get any closer to knowing the truth about such an important theology.
What many fail to understand is that salvation is entering into an authentic relationship with Jesus Christ, the King of kings, and God of glory. In order for this to happen, there must first be spiritual transaction that occurs in the life of the new believer.
Throughout the Bible, we see that God considers some to be righteous and others unrighteous. This is based one thing and one thing only: whether or not a person believes in God or not! If we consider Hebrews 11 alone, we learn how people became righteous in God’s eyes and it has nothing to do with whether or not a person can earn salvation. There is absolutely nothing we can to do to earn salvation (Ephesians 2:8-10). Salvation is a completely free gift. The only requirement – if you want to call it that – is that we believe God; who He is and what He has accomplished for us regarding salvation.
Once we believe God (take Him at His Word), our eyes become open to the truth. Once we see the truth, we have the option of embracing that truth or rejecting it. Embracing the truth about God means we also embrace the truth about salvation because there is no true salvation apart from God. This was Paul’s message as laid out in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
“1 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.
3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures…”
These verses explain very clearly what salvation is, who it is from, and what we gain from it. I bet you noticed a “problem” though, didn’t you? In verse 2, notice it says “…if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.” Many people use this verse as a prooftext for their belief that salvation can be lost. However, if we allow Scripture to interpret (or define) its own meaning, we have to use other portions of Scripture to determine the entire truth.
There is at least one response (many, in fact!) that clarifies this text from 1 Corinthians. In 1 John 2:19, John states, “They went out from us, but they were not really of us; for if they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but they went out, so that it would be shown that they all are not of us.” While John is referring to those who follow the same path of the coming Antichrists. These people are often found in churches, even as leaders. Unfortunately, they come to a point where they fully cast off any semblance of true Christianity. In that case, it is clear – according to John – that when that happens, those individuals were not truly part of the Church or they would not have left. This is actually what Paul is saying!
Paul adds the last part about holding fast the word because this is from a human perspective. Like John, Paul was assuring everyone that all true believers – all authentic Christians – would hold fast through faith! He is not saying, some might depart from the faith (and we’ll get into that in an upcoming article) as if it is possible to quit being a Christian.
We need to understand what takes place when a person truly becomes saved. We’ll deal more with that in the next installment, but let me end this one by stating what being a Christian is NOT. It is not…
- mere mental assent
- following “dos” and “don’ts”
- saying a quick prayer (e.g. “Come into my heart, Lord Jesus…”)
- going by how we feel about being a Christian
- going to church, praying, or reading your Bible
Becoming a Christian involves a spiritual transaction where a number of things happen (which we will most likely never “feel”). They are done by God and for us, in order that our lives will glorify Him. We will get to the nitty-gritty next time!
Entry filed under: christianity, eternity, Religious - Christian - End Times, Religious - Christian - Prophecy, Religious - Christian - Theology, salvation. Tags: always saved, conditional salvation, eternal security, once saved, unconditional salvation.
Study - Grow - Know 
1.
kalani sharma | May 21, 2015 at 5:58 AM
Too many compliments too little space, thanks.
LikeLike
2.
modres | May 21, 2015 at 10:25 AM
Thank you.
LikeLike
3.
Evan | May 10, 2015 at 1:54 AM
Your comparison between the 1 Cor passage and the 1 Jn passage does not make sense to me. If I understand you correctly, you are claiming that the “believers” addressed in Corinth were not really believers at all but akin to those referenced in 1 John. I don’t think the text bears that to be true at all. Notice in 1 Cor 15:1, Paul refers to whom he is writing to as the “brethren.” If Paul was writing to those who were really not of the faith, he would not be referring to them as brethren. Paul further emphasizes this fact by stating that they “received” the gospel in which they “stand.” Also one cannot logically hold fast to something (faith) unless they already possessed it to begin with.
This group is therefore different from the group referred to in 1 John. Those in 1 Jn “were not of us” to begin with. I believer you err in conflating these two distinct groups as if they were one group – i.e. those who never believed. Rather, it is clear that the former group did in fact believe.
LikeLike
4.
modres | May 10, 2015 at 5:46 AM
Actually. If you read what I said carefully Evan, I’m not saying that at all. While the groups ARE different groups, it is clear that Paul, like John, believes that authentic Christians WILL hold fast to the end.
Yes, Paul is speaking personally to a group of people whom he would classify as believers, but he couldn’t personally KNOW if everyone was actually a true believer, could he? Like John, he provided parameters.
Please take the time to reread what I wrote with care. Thanks Evan.
LikeLike
5.
Evan | May 10, 2015 at 1:50 PM
Thanks for your reply and clarification. Unless I continue to misunderstand you – we both agree that only the truly regenerated will hold fast and persevere. You claim however that Paul couldn’t personally know if everyone was a true believer is not really relevant for the following reasons. Paul did not need to know because when anyone addresses a letter – he/she can specify to whom the letter is addressed and applied to. In other words, Paul can specifically identify the recipients of whom his letter is intended – in this case the Corinthian church. As you know, the Corinthian church was a moral mess and no doubt some/many in the church were of questionable character. However when Paul addresses them as brethren, and uses terms such as received, stand, saved, hold fast, believed in vain; can there be any doubt that he specifically wrote to the regenerated? His declaration applies only to those he considers to be saved. Paul himself identified the parameters of his waring.
Therefore the word “if” is a condition indicating that one is saved IF one holds fast. Based on the plain language of the text, it is indeed possible for true believers to depart from the faith and become lost if they do not hold fast and it is for these reasons that we respectfully disagree with one another.
LikeLike
6.
modres | May 10, 2015 at 5:35 PM
“…we both agree that only the truly regenerated will hold fast and persevere.”
Yes, that is correct. That is exactly what I believe the Bible teaches, but it appears that you also believe that even true Christians can decide not to hold fast and persevere. I reject that.
I would respectfully disagree with you that Paul did not “need” to know if everyone was a believer or not at the Corinthian church. In fact, if we take the entirety of 1 Corinthians, it seems clear that Paul was very concerned about the condition of the people in that local church. It was not until 2 Corinthians where Paul is satisfied and filled with joy in realizing that the people not only did what he asked them to do, but appeared to waste no time in doing it.
I believe Paul is giving the Corinthians the benefit of the doubt in addressing them as “brethren” simply because he was addressing a specific local body of believers. I cannot believe that he assumed everyone there was authentically saved though. Do you think everyone that attends your church is authentically saved? You might and if they walk away, then you would say they “lost their faith” and ultimately rejected God in Christ. That’s not what John says though.
I go under the assumption that Satan has sown tares in with the wheat, as Jesus noted would happen once He began to build His Church. However, Jesus also clearly stated that even the gates of hell would not prevail against it. In the parable of the wheat and tares, Jesus clearly points out that the farmer is asked by the people who worked for him if they should go through and remove the tares from the wheat. The farmer essentially tells them to wait until the harvest so that it would be clearly discernible which ones were tares and which ones were wheat (cf. Matthew 13:24-30). Tares are NEVER wheat and visa versa. However, tares can LOOK like wheat in the early stages. It still doesn’t make them wheat though, does it?
Again, I fully believe that Paul was led by the Holy Spirit to write to them all as though they were all saved, but Paul really had no way of knowing that for certain. His angst and concern for them is very clear, which is not alleviated until we read 2 Corinthians. You are saying that to Paul, everyone at Corinth was authentically saved and he was concerned that some would fall away. He could not have known their heart though. It was not one of his abilities or gifts.
I would disagree completely with you that a “true” believer can depart from the faith and become lost. People have argued/debated about this since the first century. If you believe that a true Christian can actually lose their salvation, that’s up to you.
As I understand Jesus’ explanation to Nicodemus in John 3, when a person becomes saved, they are BORN AGAIN. How does one become UNBORN again? If – at the moment of salvation, we become NEW Creations – the old is gone and the new has come – how does one REVERSE that so that a person can actually go back to a time before they were born again and made new?
You also – if I may (since you brought it up) – put too little faith in God’s ability to not only BEGIN the process of salvation in each of His children, but you seem to doubt His ability to PERFECT (or complete), each believer as well (cf. Romans 8).
Jesus says He will never leave or forsake us and that nothing can take true believers out of His hand. Yet, you imply that our puny “free will” can do just that. That’s laughable, Evan.
As I’ve explained before, Paul says that NOTHING can separate us from the love of God and he provides examples. Yet, you come along and go, “well, clearly our ‘free will’ can remove us from God’s hand because that was not specifically included in Paul’s list. It is IMPLICITLY included in Paul’s list.
Our free will – such as it is – is no match for God. He will not allow ANYTHING to remove us from His presence and that includes our free will, which is absolutely no match for God. In fact, the Scriptures teach that we are bought with a price. What “slave” can decide he’s going to disengage himself from his owner?
There is much more to this that you are failing to recognize. Space does not permit me to reprint the entirety of my book here, but I wrote about this subject in a book called “Finishing the Race.”
There is an excellent probability that Paul is also speaking about the rewards believers receive at the Bema Seat of Jesus Christ – our “judgment” when it is determined what, if any, rewards each believer receives.
In 1 Corinthians 3:12-15, I believe Paul makes it very clear that there will be many Christians who will be “saved,” by barely escaping the flames.
“Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13 each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work. 14 If any man’s work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. 15 If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.”
I also believe this is why Paul told the Philippian believers the following:
“So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling…”
Paul is NOT speaking about a works-based form of salvation, therefore the ONLY option is that he is referring to REWARDS that each believer has the opportunity to gain BECAUSE of salvation and how much they are willing to commit their lives to Jesus on a moment-by-moment basis so that He will work in and through them for His purposes and glory.
I explain all of this in my book “Finishing the Race” (available via Amazon). I’m not trying to push my book on you. I’m simply saying that in that book, I go into far greater detail than I can here on my blog.
While I fully agree with you that only truly regenerated believers will hold fast and persevere (because we are sealed and indwelt with the Holy Spirit who empowers us), I fully DISAGREE with you that a person who does not do that can LOSE salvation, as I do not believe salvation can be lost at all. This is not “easy-believism.” It is understanding that salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone and salvation is a PROCESS which includes our ongoing sanctification in this life.
I also believe that Paul and John are complimentary on this issue. John states that they were not OF us because they literally walked away FROM us, proving that they did not have salvation. 1 John was written to CHRISTIANS, but not necessarily to a SPECIFIC group of local believers. It is written to the entire Body of Christ. This is one main difference between Paul’s letter to the Corinthians where Paul is dealing with very specific issues and John’s letter which deals with far more generalized issues that will – at one time or another – affect every local church group.
John is still writing to Christians though, not the world. He is providing information to Christians about the truth regarding the Incarnation, about believers loving other believers, about removing ourselves from the worldliness that surrounds us on a daily basis, and love and hatred. These are general principles that apply to ALL Christians ALL THE TIME. The specifics that Paul dealt with regarding the Corinthians were specific to that particular church, just as the issues with the Galatians were specific to that body of believers. The seven letters to specific churches in Revelation were specific to those particular churches.
I’m fine with respectfully disagreeing with you, Evan, and I do appreciate your writing to express your opinion. The difficulty is that I see your position giving far more credit to what human beings can supposedly do along with an inability on God’s part regarding what He can do where His children are concerned. That is where I believe you err.
We literally become His children and you are saying that you believe the Bible teaches that as His children, who have been sealed with the Holy Spirit and now effectively sit with Christ in the heavenly realms and have the power of the Holy Spirit within us, we can still disengage from Him, literally divorcing ourselves from God.
You believe this because it SEEMS to you that the Bible shows examples of people who actually LEAVE the faith, when in point of fact, there are tares in the church who imitate Christians but are not. These are the people who leave the faith. Since a tare is never actual wheat (but can look like wheat), ultimately, the tare will be seen for what it is – a tare.
Thanks for writing and God bless you.
LikeLike
7.
Evan | May 10, 2015 at 8:45 PM
Of course Paul was concerned about the condition of the condition of the Corinthian church as that is why he wrote his letter to them. One does not write a letter of concern to those who are still unsaved and lost so your logic does not make much sense to me. A letter is a vehicle of communication where one can specify one’s audience. It is entirely different from delivering a sermon in today’s churches where the audience is a mixed group of saved and lost people. My main objection however is l find your explanation simply ignores the terms that Paul uses in his text referring to the brethren as “received the gospel,” “saved” – terms which are exclusively used to reference believers – never for unbelievers, so in my opinion you are reading into the text and eisegeting instead of exegeting the passage. It is a logical impossibility for an unbeliever to “believe in vain” so I find your explanation to be inadequate.
You ask how does one become “unborn” again? In other words how can one become saved and born again; become lost and then born again. You assume that the scriptures do not teach this. I beg to differ because Jesus himself taught this.
In Luke 15, most teachings on the parable of the prodigal son focus on the father’s mercy and willingness to forgive his son. This is certainly true as the prodigal repented of his ways and returned to his father’s graciously open arms. However I don’t think that this aspect of the parable was Jesus’ main teaching point as Jesus repeats only one phrase in this whole story and we know that when Jesus repeats something to his listeners, he is putting emphasis on something and is very likely the main point of his teaching so we’d better take heed. In verses 24 & 32 the father describes his son as being dead but alive AGAIN; was lost but is found. How can someone be made alive again? We are born again once when we first believe but how is the son made alive a second time? Note that the father described his son as being dead – not physically dead but spiritually dead as the son obviously did not die in the story. The son was spiritually alive when he abided in his father’s house but when he separated himself to pursue a lifestyle of sin and squander his inheritance, he became spiritually dead. When he repented and returned to his father seeking forgiveness he was made ALIVE AGAIN. Thus Jesus’ point is that a believer/child of God can forfeit their salvation/inheritance when they no longer abide and choose to walk after the flesh and live an unrepentant lifestyle. If one truly repents God forgives as he did the prodigal and the person becomes alive again; but if one remains in an unrepentant condition, one becomes spiritually dead and separated from God.
LikeLike
8.
modres | May 10, 2015 at 8:57 PM
Evan, what you do not seem to grasp is that DEBATING is POINTLESS. You have CLEARLY arrived at conclusions from which you are immovable.
I am not ignoring anything, in spite of the fact that you firmly believe I am. This is what troubles me about this type of debate. Each time you write, you introduce something new to the discussion, which creates a meandering trail of useless and pointless talking points. We could discuss/debate this until the Lord Jesus returns and we would be no closer to resolving this issue.
If you do not believe I have adequately responded to your comments or questions, that’s fine. I beg to differ and I believe my words are clear enough. You, on the other hand, are muddying the waters by seemingly infusing words with your own meaning that I do not find supported in Scripture.
The Prodigal Son was a parable that was intended to show the ETERNAL love of the father. That was actually the MAIN point of the parable, though obviously, as you stated, you disagree. It was a parable, not a true story.
In that particular CULTURE of which the parable is told, a son who so willingly disowned his own FATHER was often SEEN by many (not necessarily the father), as having “died.” This would be the expected reaction of those within the community. For the sake of the father – whose son had so disrespected him in such a way – the men of the community would treat that son as though he were dead.
This is simply a cultural reference that is not a metaphor for anything “spiritual.” In point of fact, the son never stopped being the son and it is clear from the parable that this is how the father viewed things. The son returned and the father gave him a new start and in doing, literally announces to the community that his son, who was seen as being dead by many of them, is now alive. He was making it clear to everyone that they should treat his son no longer as someone who had died, but who was once again among the living. This has nothing to do with a supposed spiritual message and everything to do with the cultural norms and expectations of that particular day and age. There is no reason to read “into” the text (eisigesis) believing that the text actually means something far deeper than it does. I believe you have sincerely missed the boat on this, Evan.
The fact that the father in the parable stood up for his son and essentially demanded of the community that they now stop treating the son as though he had “died” and accept him as being “alive” was another characteristic of a father who loves his son without measure. This is the way God loves His own.
I guess I simply do not understand this “drive” that some like yourself have to go to a person’s blog and attempt to debate. It makes no sense to me, as I don’t spend my time doing that at all. Jesus never debated. He simply stated and people were free to accept or reject that truth. You’re not really interested in what I’m saying. You’re interested only in proving me wrong because you specifically believe that people can lose their salvation.
As I mentioned, this debate has been ongoing since the beginnings of the church. Are you that arrogant to actually believe you are going to solve that debate once and for all?
You are absolutely and most assuredly entitled to your opinion, Evan. Please try to appreciate the fact that I do not write articles here for the purpose of entering into extended debate with people. A bit of give and take is fine. Extended debate is a waste of time. I write articles for my own (and other’s), edification. People are free to reject them, as some have done. If this is the way you view this (or all) my articles, that’s fine. I would encourage you to simply move on.
If you wish to express your opinion in a continued and ongoing fashion, then I suggest doing so at your own blog or website. Forgive me, but I’ve really grown tired of folks like yourself who believe it is their mission in life to point out flaws they see in the writings of others. It serves no real purpose.
I’ve tried to be patient and polite, but I’m asking you to simply move on, all right? Thank you.
LikeLike
9.
Is Salvation a Sure Thing or Dependent Upon Us? Part 2 | Study - Grow - Know | May 4, 2015 at 7:48 AM
[…] the first in this series – Is Salvation a Sure Thing or Dependent Upon Us? Part 1 – we barely introduced the concept of whether or not salvation is eternally secure or if it […]
LikeLike
10.
Sherry | April 27, 2015 at 9:08 AM
I can certainly understand how some people could believe one can lose their salvation for some scriptures, like the one you posted, used to trip me up! Once I learned that a person who walks away from the faith never had salvation in the first place I “got it.” Its impossible! Even the demons believe but God has refused them the spiritual transaction needed for salvation. Jesus will lose not one person that God has given to Him. Now, what you told Derrick, about faith and salvation being two different things, I’m coming to an even better understanding! I look forward to reading more about that.
Have a wonderfully blessed day!~
LikeLike
11.
modres | April 27, 2015 at 11:26 AM
Yes, that’s it exactly. As long as people hunt ‘n peck or choose this verse over that one (instead of seeing how they are actually complementary), the confusion will remain. It happens to all of us, myself included. Perseverance is the key. You have a wonderful day as well! 🙂
LikeLike
12.
Derick | April 26, 2015 at 7:50 PM
I suppose you next are going to say, well “that depends on your definition of what is “is” ” and that Sunday should be a required law to worship every week?
Or there is no way for a disciple of the Lord to lose salvation, by adopting New-Age hearsay balogna?
Even though I have seen many lose their faith and thus salvation.
Pharisee Paul made a common argument – He said “Man is created to know the word, and know that he is of God.”
This deceptive argument is all over the Church hierarchies, and I suspect allows for blasphemy.
For example, knowing this, if you simply remain peaceful and adopt New Age thinking into Christianity including Islam….This should not hurt anyone, after all, all faiths should be welcome.
However John the revelator warned this hearsay would lead to a loss of faith and salvation. I can accept I have Christ consciousness and he will return as a energy form to overthrow the beast.
A Sunday law is a road to purgatory…
LikeLike
13.
modres | April 26, 2015 at 8:07 PM
I’m not sure how you went from me saying you cannot lose your salvation to accusing me of believing that Christians must worship on Sunday.
I think you should re-read what I’ve written Derrick.
I think if a person literally walks away from Jesus, He never truly had salvation in the first place, which was the reason I referenced 1 John, as merely one example.
People who walk away from the “faith” are indeed lost, but you are assuming that this “faith” that is being discussed IS salvation. I think you’re completely wrong.
But here’s the thing, Derrick. As I clearly stated in my article, I cannot convince anyone of anything. That’s God’s job.
What I cannot stomach is people like yourself who are so set in your ways, so sure of yourself, that if God Himself offered to correct you, you would likely say, “Get behind me, Satan!”
If you do not accept Paul’s teachings as from the Lord, then I cannot help you. I realize that there are sects who completely ignore the teachings of Paul and you appear to be among them.
You’re welcome to your beliefs, Derrick. The problem is that you do not answer to me. You and I both answer to the same Person in the end.
I’m really not sure how you have made some of the jumps you have made in your brief diatribe, but I have written one book – Chrislam – on the subject of the dangerous heresy that is entering the local church.
I will also state this: you have NEVER seen anyone lose their salvation because there is no way that you would ever KNOW if they actually had it to begin with. Stop playing God, will you?
You’ve seen people walk away from the “faith,” but what is that? You say it’s salvation. It’s not and I’ll explain in an upcoming article.
If you cannot be civil, Derrick, please do not waste my time in posting your comments here, all right? Thank you.
LikeLike